Ummm? Would somebody please enlighten me on the reforms these people demanded that didn't happen?
Future U-kraine
that didn't happen? and what happen they should go home?
Orangeman5100
What?
Thomas
The country at the start had a highly dysfunctional govt so a revolt happened and right sector came to power, Russia invades Crimea so then more territories divide to pro-Russian separatists like Donetsk. Interim Government of Ukraine is referred to be fascist, in the meantime allows justification of separatist territories.
Angela3083
Wrong the USA decided who went into power in Ukraine regardless. Russia never invaded Crimea the Crimean's choose to be part of Russia without 1 person being killed. It all about gas pipes & Nato wanting a base in Ukraine. The Eastern Ukraine know the score and are defending their corner.
Blake Smith
that's wrong the Russians said they were the ones that went into crimea after the fact, and a Ukrainian solider was killed during a confrontation with the russians
jakatom
Does it matter what they want?...if it did, they wouldn't protest for a whole year. It matters what the USA and their EU lackeys want.
Blake
im pretty sure this video is about the protestors
nightlightabcd
Apparently, you want what the pro-Russian "lackeys" want!
James Murrey
The current "government" was about to pass laws banning the use of Russian language. Since 90% of Eastern Ukraine speak Russian (you know.... the native language of the land), they are now trying to split from Ukraine to not be killed by the neo-nazi(s) in power. Do you own research, even this vice dispatch hasn't been 100% truthful. Avoid Reddit, it's purely 'murrican shills spreading false propaganda (like Russian invaded Krim [Russia never sent a single military unit there; instead they hired a PMC to go in and secure the region]).
Culturebreach
Explain to people how neo-nazis are the majority in the Ukrainian protests? There is a presence of neo-nazis in Russia whilst the 3rd largest party in Russia is considered a fascist party.
BlackCousins4life
These aren't the same people who demanded reform. The people who protested against Yanukovych wanted the country to move away from Russia and closer to the European Union, for economic reasons, lessening of corruption and whatnot. When Yanukovych fled the country, they basically got their wish. The newly elected president is committed to Ukraine becoming part of the EU. These protesters have now either gone home or are fighting against separatists and Russian green men is eastern Ukraine. The people now on Maidan are not the same people, so it's hard to see them having any demands. I think they're just homeless and have settled nicely there, so they don't want to leave.
ConcordDown
you got it all figured out, you should join FOX news and make a story :) lot's of people would buy it!
Mat
has the free trade agreement gone into place yet? outside of that, they got the EU association agreement, new president, and new parliament is set. the major euromaidan demands have been met.
there's still the implementation of those reforms, though.
The88Cheat
Change takes time and all these protesters are doing is taking up valuable resources that could be used to better the country. I doubt the new government wants to waste time fighting its own people (especially when they look completely idiotic and uneducated).
Haloreach2323
No one in America said Russia invaded Ukraine. They would be stupid to say so because we all know Ukraine would be at war with Russia. Russia didn't invade, they did something worse, took the land "for the people" like bitches.
Mat
they didn't vote, there was no actual vote you maroon. Who cares if 60% are Russian by ethnicity? That's some Anschluss thinking right there.
Haloreach2323
Doesn't matter. They still did it without the consent of Ukraine. Why not buy Crimea? Who knows? Putler probably forced the people to vote his way.
Jordan
Putin congratulated the Russian soldiers on a job well done in Crimea after it was annexed.
Was ABOUT to pass a law BANNING Russian? Are you high? First of all they tried to repeal a law that allowed Russian to be an official language. Not having Russian as official language is NOT the same as being forbidden to use Russian, you dipshit. Secondly, There are laws proposed in Russia that would ban women wearing high heels. Does it mean that anything that gets thrown up into the air becomes law? NO so you don't act on it UNLESS it becomes law. And enough with the nazi bullshit. The svoboda and right sector (parties who I assume you call nazi) ran against Poroshenko, and never got more than 1% of the Ukrainian vote. I'm willing to bet there are more xenophobic racist neo nazi skinheads in Russia than all of Europe combined. Fucking idiot.
Mat
Statistically, there are far more skinheads / neo-nazis in Russia per capita than in Ukraine by a wide margin
Look at Russia's parliament, Zhirinovsky is a racist bigot and he has the 4th largest party. The third largest, A Just Russia, supports the Russian Orthodox Army terrorist group. The second? The damn Communists!
Jordan
I find it infuriating that they have the nerve to open their mouth and call Ukrainians "neo-nazis" when they have nationalist marches in Moscow numbering THOUSANDS, with people making nazi salutes, chanting "AGAINST BLACKS" along with occasional skinhead gangs running around with bats, murdering people they don't like. Absolutely grotesque.
Jarcnus
US and EU involvement in the destabilization of the country, promotion of violence, arms and riots along with putting in puppet leadership is pretty much a fact. Whatever the FUCK Russia is doing, good or bad is reactionary. The US and west European establishment and their bankster friends wants global trade dominance. FOLLOW THE FUCK GOD DAMNED MONEY FOR ONCE. IMF nonsense abroad, austerity for the poor, international trade deal attempts and bs TPP, TTIP, TAFTA along with other nonsense. It's all to fuck over the masses in a globally run pyramid scheme. Most the wealth in the world created is fake, just so the rich can spend lavishly while the poor suffer and foot the bill.
U.S. Senators Make A Spectacle Of Themselves In Ukraine
Mat
You're so misinformed it's kind of sad.
Jarcnus
Your one sentence telling me "you're wrong" really defeated my argument, oh my.
What I learnt today
When the new president turned out to be "A strong leader for harsh times" or however the press (and people on the street) put it, i.e. the classic "fascist lie" we see in every hollywood movie.... The writing on the wall became pretty stark.
Jordan
I really wish a Russian would support his grotesque label of "fascist" even once with an actual argument. How is anyone in power in Ukraine a "fascist"? Im really curious.
Mat
It's interesting seeing as everyone calls Obama a Communist
deathtokoalas
see, it's hilarious to read these comments going back and forth. you've got multiple false narratives competing with each other, all of them promoting interests by various powerful parties. none of them have anything to do with the protests.
i had my first "aha" moment back in the late 90s, when i was still a teenager. the tv told me people were protesting against apec because of concerns over human rights abuses in china. but, that wasn't the protester's narrative - it was the narrative the state wanted, and so they replaced it. the protesters were actually concerned with the trade agreement, itself. i was a skeptical kid, i understood things were generally spun, but i never thought i'd be blatantly lied to.
the thing about the eu is not the protester's narrative, it's the state department's narrative. the reason it's the state department's narrative is that it reflects the state department's interest. so, what the tv does is show you the images of the people protesting and then tell you they're protesting for what the state department wants.
the maidan protests were/are about corruption. it was something roughly similar to the occupy movement in north america, except it got badly co-opted by a ukrainian equivalent of the tea party. the shuffle of power that happened didn't address a single one of their concerns. i guarantee you the new guy already has a slush fund and is just carrying on where the last guy left off, and the guy before him left off, and the guy before him left off....
What I learnt today
All true, except the girl before him was imprisoned for not being corruptible enough.
deathtokoalas
she was prime minister, not president, and it's not that she wasn't corruptible enough - more that she was so corrupt nobody in the sitting government could trust her.
What I learnt today
Trusting corrupt people is easy. They are predictable, just buy her. Now trusting an honest person, that is a mistake.
deathtokoalas
not really. when they're really corrupt, they're always for sale. so, you can never trust your purchase. yulia bounced around to the highest bidder, and in the end she crossed one person too many. that's why she ended up in jail.
Technology Fool
Those guys look hammered! Leave us alone more vodka
Willy
Ukraine will never be part of EU .I live in EU and nobody wants them to be part of EU.We got enough of our own problems without confronting Russian interests.Germany is the main power of EU and they have good economical relationships with Russia and depends on Russian gas. So despite the political talk Germans and rest of the EU know they cant mess with Russia.
Mat
Can't mess with Russia? Russia is nothing. It doesn't even have an economy.
What I learnt today
Russia has never needed an economy, they have resources. Not caring about all this stuff got them through WWII and will get them through again. They just don't care about anything outside Russia.
Mat
Everybody needs an economy. Oil prices drop and they're screwed. Iran or the US start exporting gas and they're sunk.
That's why you can't just be some resource sultanate.
What I learnt today
That's fine. However not how Russia thinks about it. They have a bumper crop and soon will have the pipeline to EU done. If they can beat US in Syria then the oil will flow. Until then, they laugh.
Mat
what pipeline to the EU? South Stream? That's cancelled.
What I learnt today
The overarching strategic to beat US to EU markets via Syria (or whereever US doesn't block them) is cancelled? heh righto... Guess that's why there is CIA in Syria and Russians in Ukraine. Everything you are seeing here is directly related to those markets, US fear of price differential between Syria/EU and Kuwait/US, and Russian desire to capture the EU market. This hasn't gone away, you are watching it play out.
deathtokoalas
well, it's more directly about controlling shipping lanes through strategic military placement, but controlling shipping lanes has a lot to do with opening up (or shutting down) markets.
you need to take a bit of a step back from the idea of the americans controlling markets, though, as it's a bit of an outdated thing. the united states doesn't create anything any more, except weapons. they don't have a product to sell. i see a lot of this - people trying to understand current events through the lenses of the nineteenth century...
there's some remnants of this, and russia is certainly still under state capitalism, but to take the position that america is defending markets leads to the question of what they're selling, and the answer is nothing at all.
but, the strategic military posturing has more than a little to do with it, nonetheless. they're certainly trying to control the trade routes, as a hegemon would have to do. that definitely means frustrating russian trade...
...but it's not really about competition, it's about dominance. the nineteenth century mercentalist states may have seemed like empires, but they weren't really - they were trading conglomerates that used any means necessary to get ahead.
the united states is legitimately an empire. it has tributary states, which it "protects". and those states are closer to the traditional 19th century state capitalist idea.
which goes back to the weapons, which are the product.
there's this sort of old argument floating around between trying to understand things in terms of empires dominating the world or in terms of commercial interest competing with each other. the americans have found a sort of synthesis in this, as they dominate the world by selling weapons systems.
there has to be conflict for that to happen. the commercial transactions in weapons systems consequently drive the lust for imperial domination. it's conflict for the sake of conflict, because that's the only way that america gets paid.
put a little more succinctly...
the british "empire" created conflict to open up markets.
the american empire creates markets by ensuring endless conflict.
What I learnt today
Just to add something "step back from the idea of the americans controlling markets".... It's not about selling stuff to markets. It's about making sure the EU can't/doesn't get oil 3¢ cheaper than the US.
deathtokoalas
there's certainly been some tension over the last few decades over some financial issues. you know who i think was behind 9/11? germany. yeah, the old german boogeyman, trying to start wwIII right? well, i think it was about the euro, primarily. it was a ploy to sink the dollar. every few months, you hear some news report talking about the "strained relationship", and it's quickly patched up in the media to counteract the optics. both sides are deeply interested in making things seem rosy, and the germans certainly remain in a vastly inferior position both economically and militarily - that is, they remain a client state. but i think the truth is that the germans and americans continue to see each other as their primary competitors in the world and relations are really downright hostile under the surface. if i was an american military strategist, i would not look at germany (or the eu in general, outside of the uk) as a reliable ally. when you've bullied somebody into doing what you want for 70 years, don't be surprised when they take the first opportunity they can to knock you out.
controlling the oil supply is a part of being a hegemonic power, but i can't see what you're suggesting as being an important aspect of american policy. what the americans seek is less to explicitly dominate everything around them and more to control the rules. so, they let british contractors into iraq, and refused french contractors - because they rejected the war. that's the reason france has fallen in line, since. the price of commodities is variable, and speculators make a lot of money from that. so, do the americans care about that kind of price fluctuation? no. why would they, so long as they get to write the rules of who sells what to who?
what does concern them is a russia that wants to ignore those rules, demand the rules be written collaboratively or even write their own rules. russia is a bigger country than iraq, but putin is being punished for the same reason that saddam was - he's not doing what he's told.
when genghis khan would approach a new city, he would send messengers to the city's government, offering them a choice. they could willingly submit, and be spared. or they could resist and be annihilated. a lot of cities were annihilated. a lot of cities were spared...
Willy
hmmm i wouldn't go that far to say Germany was behind it. I think that would be pretty hardcore conspiracy but hey, what do i know .At least you can think out of the box which is only good i suppose .But there sure are various reports that Germany secretly considering and negotiating with BRICS to join .Who knows maybe we will see comeback of German mark one day lol. USA sterility to provide Germany with their gold (which they don't have since USA do not own any gold resources) and empty promises to deliver their gold in near future only assure Germany to look for alternatives to ensure their economical stability.
deathtokoalas
brics is not an alliance, it's just something cnn made up. and gold is as worthless as paper. what's valuable is guns.
Orangeman5100
And oil.
deathtokoalas
commodities, in general, sure. but it's going to fluctuate with demand. if the trends towards computerization and renewable energy both continue, it won't be long before copper (also a finite resource) is more valuable than diamonds.
this is why it's so important to understand the dominance in terms of hegemony, power and control rather than any specific, narrow aim - although, that being said, the primary purpose of anglo-american foreign policy has not wavered from containing and controlling the russians at any point since 1989, or 1789, for that matter.
Orangeman5100
Sadly yes, but it'd be a lot harder for their neighbors if we didn't control them... For example, Ukraine would probably be entirely part of Russia...
deathtokoalas
well, you've got to keep in mind that a lot of the people in ukraine want to be a part of russia...
poland is a better test case, but is poland really better off in the eu? i'm not sure there's much of an argument for it, other than enforced western bias. i'm not saying they'd be better off in russia, i'm just not sure it really makes much of a difference to the average pole, in terms of living conditions.
fucking spain would be a part of russia right now, if it weren't for american intervention in wwII. but would they be worse off?
What I learnt today
OT but everytime I hear that I think of "Fast Show - Johnny Depp": "I remember during the war you yanks were in like a shot! I don't mean the actual fighting, you were a couple of years too late for that Sir." ;-)
deathtokoalas
yeah. the history books will eventually catch up, but they're kind of missing the point right now. there's all kinds of diplomatic cables from american ambassadors to the region in the 30s explaining that american policy was to covertly fund hitler with the hopes that he'd eliminate stalin. that is, it's the same old russian containment policy that traces back to the napoleonic period. when they did intervene, it wasn't to stop fascism or save the jews or help the british or anything of the sort, it was take over as much of europe as they could before the russians got there.
if the normandy invasion had not happened, stalin would have waltzed right through germany and france and parked itself outside franco's doorstep. how does the soviet socialist republic of france sound.....
Orangeman5100
Honestly, not very good...
